Monday, February 15, 2010

YHGTBKM

Monday, February 15, 2010
Anyone know what that means? The title of this blog? Come on. Everything is an abbreviation these days...

Has anyone noticed that a big percentage of the population can no longer spell? It drives me insane. Absolutely, flipping insane.

I understand the need to shorten things, but in my opinion--or should I say, IMO, it has gone so far beyond that and verges on taking over the English language.

I have been known to throw out a WTF every now and again but it is few and far between. But other than that and the clinical abbreviations we use at work, I still tend to spell everything out and yes, I CAN SPELL.

It goes beyond abbreviations but I have to wonder if that's what started the non-spelling snowball. I am amazed at the errors I see when I read some of the notes that are written at work. Such as--and I am not kidding here--Road Island, soar instead of sore, kemotherapy, Vinissuala, ruff instead of rough, netime (that's anytime folks), definately instead of definitely (that's a very common mistake but still WRONG). There are many, many more.

We are in the process of hiring personnel at the office and read numerous amounts of resumes a day. We throw 99% of them in the garbage due to typos and spelling mistakes. We could be throwing a wonderful employee in the trash but if they can't take the time to check their own resume, are they really worth our time? We have had so many bad spellers over the years that we now ask, with a laugh, during the interview, if they can spell. They all laugh right back and say, "of course." If it were up to me, I'd set up an impromptu spelling bee right then and there because 9 times out of 10 they prove to be terribly horrific spellers and it drives me CRAZY!

So, no. I am not LMAO or ROFL. I am instead, shaking my head in shame and wondering what is happening to our world. Yes, I think it's as big as that.

Thoughts?

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

By the way, the title stands for...You Have Got To Be Kidding Me. I really wanted it to say, YHGTBFKM, but I decided to leave out the expletive.

109 comments:

Christie Craig said...

Elle,

I think the texting is causing issues with the young people. Of course, emailing is not much better. That said, I'm a terrible speller. So I will have to go proof this one before I hit send. LOL.

Sisters-in-Sync said...

Barb,

i agree wit u 100%. Wats rong wit peeps? R they lz or just stupit? it's the abbrev that realy git me. we all make typeos but c'mon. i gtg 2 wrk now so ttfn n i'll right more ltr.

c u ltr.
Bren

Edie Ramer said...

The weird thing is just about everyone has spell check. Even in this comment box, the word "wierd" is underlined. (I know how to spell weird. Honest! I just typed it to see if it would come up underlined.) That's a sign that something is wrong.

Beth Ciotta said...

I'm with Christie. I think 'texting' has been a major blow to spelling. Spelling isn't the only thing suffering. What about punctuation. It drives me insane when people don't capitalize.

Twitter is another place where you see a lot of abbreviations. It's because you're only allowed 140 (or so) characters per post. Although I have abbreviated a couple of times, instead I usually challenge myself and shorten the post instead. How tight can I write without having to abbreviate or lapse to texting 'code'? As it turns out, pretty darn tight.

SIS Beth

Beth Ciotta said...

By the way, I think I'm one of the only people left on the planet who does not Text.

Brenda, I only understood about half of what you wrote. How un-hip am I?

Linda, you got an 'underlined' word in comments? Why doesn't that happen for me? I misspell words all the time when commenting due to rushing. I've never been 'underlined'. Dang.

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Hi Christie,

Thanks for stopping by. Texting is absolutely one of the main issues behind all this. I text but I spell it all out. The person on the other end is probably wondering what's wrong with me. Ya know?

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Elle J Rossi said...

Bren,

YRSAN.

But thanks for the laugh and I can totally picture you cracking yourself up!

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Elle J Rossi said...

Edie,

I know. That's what really blows me away. People must see the red line! Are they too lazy to correct it or do they think the red line means something else entirely????

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Elle J Rossi said...

Beth,

I have got to get you texting. I promise, I'll keep them short. Twitter is another thing I just don't get. Maybe you can explain that to me sometime.

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

MIckey Miller said...

I agree that the abbreviations are getting really bad. I'm not going to lie though, I use them a lot. It has gotten so bad that I have to double check all of my papers for school, so I know I did not throw some random abbreviations in there. I don't really mind if it is in a im or text but do we really need to same them out loud. I understand saying a WTF if you are out in public but do you realy need to say out loud that you are loling I should be able to see that. I like your topic today.

Wildheart said...

Nope, Beth, you're not alone. :) I don't text and I don't Twitter. I am an editor and it drives me insane to see all of the typing, spelling, and punctuation errors that come in on submissions; even my own authors still have misspelled words. I shudder to think about what's happening to our English language--and, indeed, all the world's languages. We can't be the only ones with this gripe.

Beth Ciotta said...

Barb/Elle, I appreciate the offer to teach me how to text, but A)Steve and I don't have a texting plan on our phone so it would be costly for me to text and B) I don't see the point.

When I'm at work I don't carry my phone around--I'm working. If someone needs me they can call and leave a message or email me. I'll get back to them as soon as I can--by returning the call or email. I suppose I should learn to Text for emergency sake--for instance there's an intruder in the home (God forbid) and I need to alert the police 'silently'. But other than that, for me, personally, it holds no attraction.

The Dinasaur,
SIS Beth

Beth Ciotta said...

Mickey --as in Michael? Or is there another M. Miller out there I should know? It was great to see you weigh in on this. A younger generation is certainly going to have a whole different take on Texting, or rather abbreviating for Texts or IMs. I suppose that it becomes so natural, such the norm, that having to actually write words out, to pay attention to spelling and punctuation is quite the chore. It was nice to hear that one must still attack writing formally on school papers. I'm worried the day looms when 'Texting style' becomes acceptable even in school. That's scary on several levels.

SIS Beth

Olga said...

Great post! I agree with texting, but even I start using LOL a lot, and I don't even text that much. Something should be said for preservation of language as we know it.

Beth Ciotta said...

Greetings, Wildheart and welcome to SIS. I'm really glad you chimed in on Barb/Elle's post. Yet another interesting viewpoint!

I confess it's never crossed my mind that a writer would submit a dreadfully sloppy manuscript. The competiton is so fierce, why would you turn in work riddled with spelling and punctuation errors and typos? Trust me, I have weaknesses in those areas, but I'm pretty anal about spellcheck and double check for other mistakes, too. I also count on one or two CPs to catch any mistakes I've missed. Even then it never fails that some mistake slips by, no matter how many times I/we read through. For instance, while doing revisions I just found two places where I wrote 'hear' instead of 'here'! How the heck does that happen? I swear I know the difference!

Speaking of revisions... I best get back to them.

Great topic Barb/Elle!

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Mickey,

You are joking, right? People actually say LOLing? That's it! I've heard it all now.

How often do you catch yourself putting an abbreviation/acronym into one of your papers? At least you have the sense to double check.

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Elle J Rossi said...

Wildheart,

Thanks so much for stopping by. I'm curious. What do you do with those submissions? Do you disregard them right away? Is the content ever enough to excuse the errors? Do you get to send a polite yet pointed email/letter stating, "Thanks, but no thanks. Learn to spell."?

I'll admit, I don't always know when to use a comma but you can bet your bottom I'll check with someone that does!

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Elle J Rossi said...

Okay, Beth.

No worries. I won't make you text!

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Elle J Rossi said...

Olga,

"Preservation of language"

I love that. We should have a national Preserve Our Language month. No abbreviations/acronyms allowed and everyone has to take daily spelling tests!

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

SIS BJ said...

Hi Barb,

I don't text. Like Beth, I don't see the point.

I have heard that some teachers are letting kids get away with using abbreviations on school work. They blame it on the fact that they text all the time.

Elle J Rossi said...

BJ,

Seriously? That infuriates me. How is that teaching people/children anything? It's laziness, pure and simple.

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

SIS BJ said...

Barb, I read an article about it last year. I wish I could remember where.

Chris Behrens said...

I think it also has to do with the fact that today's society is more prone to Attention Deficit Disorder and is so used on instant gratification that it's become more important to get a message out quickly than to have a message that is error free and complies with accepted writing standards.

SIS BJ said...

Barb, If you think that is bad. Most of our third graders here in Indiana can't read at grade level. Most are reading at first grade level. I blame that on both the parents and the teachers.

Chris Behrens said...

I should have said "so used to", not "so used on". See what I mean?

Beth Ciotta said...

<<...today's society is more prone to Attention Deficit Disorder and is so used on instant gratification that it's become more important to get a message out quickly than to have a message that is error free..>>

Actually, sadly, that makes sense, Chris. As to typos, I often make them when in a rush and always cringe when I notice them later. Cringe, because it's embarrassing to come across as uneducated or uncaring. I don't think a good lot of 'today's society' look at it that way. As you said, it's about speed.

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Chris,

Welcome to SIS. Glad you could stop by.

Instant gratification may be the downfall of everything. Where's our pride? Where's our sense of accomplishment when we work hard at something and get it right?

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Beth Ciotta said...

<<...Most of our third graders here in Indiana can't read at grade level. Most are reading at first grade level. I blame that on both the parents and the teachers....>>

BJ, I do believe that's the case in many states, not just Indiana. However, having friends in the education industry, I have to say I blame the parents more than teachers. It all starts at home. Don't get me started.

Elle J Rossi said...

Oh, BJ.

You are really ruining my day! What a sad tale that it. Children need to read. Children need to want to read. So, yes. I agree with you. I fault the parents and some of the teachers.

SIS Barb aka Elle J Rossi

Chris Behrens said...

I agree, Beth. It's a very bad combination of lack of education, laziness, quantity over quality, and impatience. Not to steer the topic away from where it is, but what if anything do you all think can realistically be done to change any of this?

Elle J Rossi said...

Chris,

An image of a ruler slapping knuckles comes to mind...

Tori Lennox said...

All this text-ese drives me INSANE too!!! I do use some of the standard abbreviations like LOL, ROFL, WTG (way to go), and such but that's more because my hands get tired and start hurting so I shorten things I can. But so many status updates on Facebook leave scratching my head as I try to decipher what the heck they're saying. Sometimes I never do figure it out and have to ask point blank.

Oh, and "Road Island" cracked me up. Wouldn't that commonly be called the median? LOL!


And, Beth, I don't text either. I don't even have a cell phone! Twitter is a challenge, though. *g*

Chris Behrens said...

I wish I knew, Elle. We as a nation used to be so proud of the kind of people we were and the things that we accomplished. It's become so backwards that people that play professional sports are paid more and are looked up to more than teachers, law enforcement, and other people who are truly worthy.

SIS BJ said...

Beth, I mainly fault the parents. The reason I fault teachers is because they allow these children to pass to the next grade. I know that it is hard to hold a child back because parents will complain about it. They are trying to pass a law that would have all third graders raeding at grade level before they can pass. That will make it easier on the teachers.

Chris Behrens said...

Ahh, the good old days of ruler hand slapping...

Elle J Rossi said...

Tori,

I know what you mean. I've had to ask people what certain things mean and they sometimes treat as thought I'm the stupid one. Really?

As far as Road Island: I couldn't believe it. It was just a joke at work. I pitted certain non-spellers against other in a can-you-spell-our-states game. I love her to death but could not believe she actually wrote that and was certain it was correct.

Beth Ciotta said...

I don't think you're steering off topic, Chris. I think it's all related, and, boy, do I wish I had an answer to your question. I don't think anything can be done about the abbreviations and lack of punctuation used while Texting. It's the nature of the beast. I think Barb/Elle, who spells everything out while texting, is probably in the minority (Go, Barb!)

However, I do feel it's imperative (yes, I actually stopped and took a moment to make sure I spelled that right. I didn't, but I fixed it.) that the school system holds strong and continues to demand that formal writing skills, correct English, is taught by teachers and carried out by the students. I was stunned by BJ's post saying she'd read some schools are allowing abbreviation. That's shameful. Shameful and lazy. How is that 'helping' future generations?

Yikes. I'm one step away from my soapbox. Let me take a breath . . .

SIS Beth

Beth Ciotta said...

<<...It's become so backwards that people that play professional sports are paid more and are looked up to more than teachers, law enforcement, and other people who are truly worthy...>

Get off my wave length, Chris! Heh. Oh... the soapbox beckons....

Elle J Rossi said...

Step up, Beth. Let that rant out. That's what we are here for!

Excuse me, everyone. May we have your attention please?

Beth Ciotta said...

Tori, I hear you. Okay. I must ask. Brenda, what does TTFN mean? And Barb, what's YRSAN?

Crimany. It's like learning a whole new language.

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

However, it is not the fault of the athletes or the actors. They are placed on that pedestal by the people around them. We may think they are overpaid but they make a lot of money for a lot of people.

Is it skewed? Yes. Should teachers make more money? Perhaps. Prove your worth. TEACH. It should be based on results rather than on district or seniority.

Elle J Rossi said...

I'll speak for Bren. TTFN is ta ta for now and YRSAN is one for Bren to figure out. I'm basically calling her a name. I'm sure she'll be back later with the answer to that question.

Chris Behrens said...

Go Beth go!!

Beth Ciotta said...

Ta-Ta-for-now? Seriously? Good grief.

Okay. Waiting to hear if Brenda figures out your challenge, Elle.

BJ... Thank you for the clarification. Actually, I've heard of that happening, too. Teachers are in a sticky spot. The school system needs to step up.

SIS Beth

Chris Behrens said...

We've talked about spelling, punctuation and abbreviations, so allow me to throw this out for discussion: What do you think about the different 'emoticons' that some people use, primarily online and in e-mails? 'Emoticons' are the different kinds of faces, like :) or ;)

Elle J Rossi said...

Chris,

I actually think they're cute. Maybe that's the girl in me. I actually don't mind them because they can help with the tone of an email. One may take something as harsh when it was not intended that way at all. Strategically inserting an emoticon could change all that. Perhaps a phone call would have been a better solution. It's hard to misinterpret the tone of someone's voice. But then again, people would actually have to speak to each other which is a whole other issue!

Beth Ciotta said...

I agree with Elle. I like emoticons. For the exact same reason. When we're speaking with someone in person, they can see our expression. We can say something sarcastic and they know we're kidding. Even speaking over the phone, you can at least hear a telling inflection in tone. Not so with email. It reads flat or can easily be misinterpreted. As someone who once horribly misinterpreted someone's meaning in an email, I for one welcome a smiley face or whatever.

On the other hand, I know people who find them very annoying. Too cutesy. A cop-out. Translation: you should be able to get across your true meaning with words alone.

What's your take, Chris?

SIS Beth

Chris Behrens said...

I definitely agree that they can help interpret the mood and meaning of the writing in which they're used. Words on a screen or page are pretty much just that until given some context, and I think emoticons can do just that. I think that the smiley faces that I used to get on my papers in Elementary School were the precursors of today's emoticons.

Tricia Fields said...

I'm going to chime in and say that TTFN is not a new texting or Twitter abbreviation. It was said by Tigger in Disney's "The Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh" movie from the 70s.

As for other abbreviations, I do use them when I can't cut down a "tweet", but I generally write out my texts and punctuate them properly. It drives my daughter crazy! And is one of the main reasons that I do it.

Sisters-in-Sync said...

Holy Cow! You really opened a can of worms.

First of all....HELLO CHRIS! Nice to see, er, hear you here at SIS.

TTFN is from Tigger of Winnie the Pooh fame. And I think he even said "TTFN"...could be wrong about though.

YRSAN....At first I though it meant "You really suck ass nerd" but just now I realized it's probably "You are such a nerd". Am I right?

In Florida, children are not allowed to move on to first grade if they can't read at a certain level. Yes, in Kindergarten they are expected to read at a level that might surprise you. They are also required to read at a certain level in third grade before they can move on to fourth. We have testing here called FCAT and it is given every year to all grades, and there are certain grade levels that have to pass that test before they can move on. Children are required to read at least 30 minutes every day. It is part of their homework and must be logged and signed by the parents.

I text often. Sometimes it's just easier. But like Barb, I spell things out. It takes longer, but at least the person on the other end knows exactly what I am trying to say.

And as long as we're talking about the English language...it really bothers my husband and I when we go to a drive-"thru" and the person speaking through the speaker says "Go head wit chur order". Really...

SIS Bren

Beth Ciotta said...

Hi, Tricia,

Welcome to SIS and thank you for chiming in. I'm a little embarrased that I didn't know TTFN originated with Tigger. I love Winnie-the-Pooh. Curious. Did he just use the initials or was it the whole saying? (How can I not know this??)

<<...but I generally write out my texts and punctuate them properly. It drives my daughter crazy! And is one of the main reasons that I do it....>>

Now THAT made me laugh out loud! :-)

Oh, and HEY, I'm comment #50! I don't think we've ever had 50 comments! Do I get a prize?

SIS Beth

Beth Ciotta said...

Oh, DANG! Bren beat me to it. She's 50. I'm 51. Well, DANG!

SIS Beth

Chris Behrens said...

Hello Brenda! It's nice to be heard here. And you're absolutely right about the requirements for school children here. There's hope yet for the future. As far as the language goes, I'm not all that optimistic, especially when we just had a President that couldn't pronounce the word "nuclear". I think I hear more and more abuse of the English language the older I get, from slang to outright misuse of the language. Or maybe I'm just getting picky in my old age. If we keep this up, maybe we can hit 100 comments before we're through!

triciafields said...

Beth, I agree with Bren, I think that Tigger actually said, "TTFN", but I haven't watched the movie in a while, so I could be wrong. And, yes, anything I can do to drive the 15 year old crazy is a plus! Believe it or not, I'm considered the cool mom. This also drives her insane!

A "mispronunciation" that gets me every time is Optober instead of October. But "wit' chur" or "wit' chu" ranks up there, also.

I do like emoticons, when used sparingly, because they can take the sting out of what might otherwise come across sounding harsh or judgmental. (And I always want to add an "e" to judgmental...)

trish

trish

Grace Tyler said...

OK, I'm going to chime in at the risk of getting you all to gang up on me. We're writers, so it's far more important that we come off looking like we are literate. But for the general populace, who cares?

Some of the smartest people I have ever known couldn't spell worth beans. Of course, they usually hire someone to write letters for them, but the coworker still has to read/decipher their post-its or emails. Partially this is because it wasn't important to them. Is calculus or computer coding important to you?

And as for the texting, I started texting sometime back when I had a phone with just the number keypad. This means that you have to tap each number a certain number of times until the right letter comes up. I.e., if the number "2" key types "A, B, or C" then you tap it once to get an "A", twice to get a "B", etc. And punctuation/capitalization? Forget it! That was an absolute b*tch. I was stubborn and tried to do it "right," but I didn't text much. Then my niece and my SIL started to text me all the time--much more than they would call. And it was easier to get hold of them by text as well. So I bought a phone with a QWERTY keyboard. The face slides open to reveal the keyboard, and you get to type with your thumbs. *joy* I am a total tech junkie, so I LOVED it.

I am all about communicating with the teens/tweens in my life. Do I care how hard it is to read the texts the 14 yo sends me? No. I refused to buy her the more expensive phone until she's older, so she texts me with the 0-9 keypad and abbreviates everything. I am pleased she is talking to me. I don't care how crappy the quality.

If my son goes around saying "OMG" out loud (he's 10) I don't bug him about it. I do remind him that in our family we're not supposed to say what OMG stands for and I'd rather he not say the abbreviation either, but I'm not sweating about it.

And I used to run the live author chats at Romance Junkies. It's hard when you're messaging live, fast and furious, to be perfect. I always told the authors that typos don't count on messaging/IM. I stand by that. I tried hard to spell my own messages accurately, but I ignore the typos of others as much as I can. Communication comes before perfection.

When it comes to email, I think those should be as literate as possible. But personal emails can have abbreviations, IMO (in my opinion). No biggie. Message boards? Sure. Communication before perfection.

When imperfection gets in the way of communication, then we better all slow down. But in the meantime, I look forward to the next text message from my daughter--in barely decipherable English.

Elle J Rossi said...

Hi Tricia,

Texting in complete sentences drives my friends crazy. When my daughter is old enough, I'm sure she'll think I'm ancient in my way of thinking.

Elle J Rossi said...

Welcome back, Bren.

While your first thought was definitely funnier, the second one was correct.

Kudos to Florida. All educational systems should run this way.

Grace Tyler said...

Yes, Tigger actually said, "TTFN."

Elle J Rossi said...

Tricia,

People really say, Optober? That's worse than libary (liberry).

Beth Ciotta said...

Tricia, you and Bren are absolutely right about Tigger. I googled (not that I didn't believe you, but because I felt like a goof). First thing I came across was a cute patch with Tigger and TTFN big above him. :) Gee. Tiger was ahead of his time.

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Grace,

Thank you so much for chiming in and for your thoughts. I do love a good debate.

I completely understand leaving the lines of communication, in any form possible, for our teens. Any way we can encourage them to "speak" is beneficial for all. But, I have to ask, at what cost?

It seems to me that they are so into texting and such that they can't manage to hold a conversation, without looking like a panicked deer. Has it always been that way? Somewhat. In recent years, it is becoming much more of a problem.

My four year old son would be a video game addict if I allowed it. It's all he can think about. Why is that? It's a daily struggle to get him to do things that allow him to be creative and still talk to me without constantly staring at the TV.

I know as writers that we HAVE to spell correctly, but I don't feel that should excuse the rest of the general population. maybe I don't understand the science behind it. How can a person be incredibly successful but can't spell even simple words? Maybe I need to look more into the possible medical reasons behind it.

That aside, in my opinion, all the abbreviations/acronyms are perpetuating the problem. And to those that just say these are the times we live in...I feel that is a sorry excuse for laziness.

And you're right, Grace. Typos don't count. Usually.

SIS Brandy said...

What is going on here? Lots of discussion today huh?

I text a lot and don't abbreviate anything. I also think I am a pretty good speller.

I was very suprised to read BJ's comment about most 3rd graders only reading at a 1st grade level. I would have never guessed. My girls haven't had any problems so I guess I would have never even thought about it.

I agree that all of these abbreviations do make our kids lazy. But then, a lot of things in this world make our kids lazy!!

I have problems reading all of these different abbrevs. I am finishing up that Black Dagger Brotherhood series and it has had a lot of those in it. It takes me awhile to figure some of the out. I did figure out YRSAN though. That's just because I am a nerd too!!

Beth Ciotta said...

Hi, Grace, and welcome! Great to see you here. I won't gang up on you because you presented another side of the topic extremely well. Some interesting points I wouldn't have thought of. If texting keeps you better in touch with the teens/Tweens in your life then fantastic! What matters the form of communication if you are communicating?

Although I probably didn't make myself clear, I guess I wouldn't mind the abbreviations in Texting if they didn't carry over to other areas of writing, such as emails (which is today's version of writing letters) and school papers and other forms of written communication. The English language is taking a beating and I can't help it, but I do think it matters.

On another point, I had to laugh when you described texting on the kind of phone that only has a number keypad. That's what I have! Maybe I'd feel differently about texting (personally) if I had a phone with slide out keyboard with letters. :)

As to the live author chats at Romance Junkies (I love RJ!) or any other chat of that nature, I totally agree with you. I've been lucky enough to participate in a few of those chats. I was STUNNED at how fast the questions and comments fly. I am NOT a fast typist and made plenty of typos just trying to keep up. I don't think anyone notices typos, or gives them weight in instances like that. That's a different animal.

I feel like I've contridicted myself here and there, but you did present some interesting angles, Grace. Have to love a great debate! Thanks so much for chiming in.

And lest I be pegged as a hypocryte, I do confess to using OMG, LOL, IMO, and BTW upon occasion.... and now I am itching to use TTFN just because I love Tigger and Pooh. Although... I must say, today's conversation has inspired me to be less lazy when time permits. Inspire by example.

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Brandy,

About time you got here! JR Ward is totally and completely excused. I don't mind one iota when The Black Dagger Brotherhood is throwing around a couple WTF's and BRB's. Doesn't hurt that they're stinking hot.

Man, I think I just confessed to being shallow.

Sydney:) said...

U know i dont see anything wrong wit shortening stuff i do it all the time. See even right now im doin it even tho im not tryin, just a force of habit:) Idk maybe its an age thing me bein 14 and all and all of u guys tendin to b way older than me:P Just had to say that:)

I txt all the time and dont see a problem wit it. It makes it way more convenient and faster. Shortening my stuff is just a way to speed up things. Even tho I do that. I'm still a good speller. When in school I do just fine wit my spelling and am a lot better than a lot of my other fellow students.:)

The coolest neice (and daughter,
Sydney:)

Sandy said...

Great topic, Elle. I think it's a shame and a disaster that we may have to live with for years to come.

In fact, it may stay with us.

Grace Tyler said...

Hoboy. My son says "IDK" and "BRB" out loud ALL THE TIME. Not the worst thing ever. But...

Beth Ciotta said...

You know that term.... Generation Gap? :)

I'm sure you're right, Sydney. No doubt much of this, what side of the track you stand on on the issue, is an 'age thing'.

I imagine it would be hard to argue this topic with any, or at least most any teen. And it's hard to argue with you as you made your point so good-naturedly. So I won't pester you... as long as you excel at spelling in school and other places where it really counts like--as Barb/Elle pointed out--a job resume. And I'm sure you will because you are not only school smart, but people smart. And yes... A very cool niece. :)

Hugs--SIS Beth (who, as you know, can't even program numbers into her phone)

Beth Ciotta said...

Help, Grace! Sydney? Brandy? Enlighten please. IDK. Is that I don't know? What about BRB?

SIS Beth

Sisters-in-Sync said...

Be right back

SIS Bren

Sisters-in-Sync said...

And yes, IDK is I don't know

Beth Ciotta said...

Duh.

Thanks, Bren.

SIS Beth

Sydney:) said...

Yes i am right its totally an age thing:)

Yes we know if u argue wit me about this i will be the one to win.. i never lose:) im good at many things in school math and language bein my two best subjects:) which reminds me im in the academic super bowl for math and ive got an A+ in that class... Go me!:) And thank ya thank ya I get told that frequently:) i am pretty ppl smart aren't I?:)

And yes as i know you couldnt even do that nor did you know had to send photos or take photos or even save photos:) but I taught u some stuff that day i sure hope u havent forgotten cuz I'd rather not go over that again. lol:)

Hugs right back at ya-Sydney:)

Sydney:) said...

and good job Beth. As Brenda said IDK is I dont know and BRB is be right back:)

Beth Ciotta said...

Sandy, I think we'll definitely have to live with it. As you can see, teens like Sydney (love you, Syd) see absolutely nothing wrong with streamlining their words. She's just one of a whole generation. This new mode of conversing isn't going anywhere. I just worry where it might take us.

SIS Beth

Sydney:) said...

Wooh, Go Sydney!!:)

Beth Ciotta said...

Good Lord. I feel ancient. My head hurts just trying to make sense of your note, Sydney. But I got the gist. LOL

Oh, and I absolutely won't diss someone who made the Academic Super Bowl of Math! (You go!) Anything having to do with numbers makes me break out in a sweat. That and trying to program things to into my phone and sending pictures, etc. Yes, I forgot what you taught me. Practice makes perfect and I did not practice. :)

SIS (Aunt) Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Sydney,

I beg you. Please type a proper comment so you can prove that you do in fact know how to spell. And why can you use punctuation marks to make smiley faces but not use them to end a darn sentence? I love you to death but seriously,do me a favor and give it a try!

Elle J Rossi said...

Big waves to Sandy!

I'm not that old. Really, I'm not. But I don't get it. Is it wrong to come across as semi intelligent these days? It really, really bothers me.

You are so right. It's a shame and there's probably nothing we can do about it.

Grace Tyler said...

Being well spoken usually indicates intelligence. However, lacking the ability to speak/write eloquently does not mean that someone ISN'T intelligent. This is a subtle prejudice.

As for the job resumes, if I were hiring, it would depend on what the job entailed as to whether or not poor spelling or sentence construction would preclude an applicant from getting the job. If I were hiring in the office staff, damn straight! If I were hiring a nurse, a chemist, a computer programmer, a rocket scientist, a mathematician--not necessarily. Poor writing and spelling skills make one sound uneducated, but again, this is a subtle prejudice, and we have to get past the surface. (If we can. hahaha)

Sydney:) said...

Ok here it goes. My name is Sydney. I live in a big house. See this isn't that hard. I have two sisters and a mom named Brandy and a dad named Jeremy.

Ok sorry I had to be a smart butt. So back on track. As for Beth, may I say thank you. You are kidding me right I have to teach you all of that again!! You are very lucky I love you. As for Barb smiley faces are my thing they are a total force of habit. I can obviously spell see, xylophone, pneunomia, malignant, ok thinking of big words is hard but you get what i'm saying.

Ok there you go Barb I typed a proper comment.

Elle J Rossi said...

Thank you, Syd!

I knew you had it in you.

Love you!

Sydney:) said...

You are vey welcome!!

How could I not have it in me I am amazing like that.

I love you too!

Elle J Rossi said...

You hit the nail on the head, Grace. It is prejudice and I'm not sure I would describe it as subtle.

It does make some appear uneducated, which is sad in itself. Like you said, some of these applicants may be very intelligent, but unfortunately my first impression of them is quite the opposite.

There may be a way to fix this. Perhaps the applicant should hand deliver their resume. Dress appropriately, make eye contact, firm handshake and a little conversation would go a long way. Then I may be able to excuse a misspelled word or two.

Compromise! I love it.

Beth Ciota said...

Laughing out loud, but beaming with pride at the same time. You're something else, Smart Butt, er, I mean, Sydney. What exactly, I'm not sure. :) See, I like smiley faces, too. But, I also like to read coherent sentence.

Yes, I forgot everything you showed me. And yes, I'm awfully glad you love me. Right back at you!

SIS Beth

Beth Ciotta said...

This leads to another kind of predjudice--a tad off topic, but having to do with intelligence and taxed skills.

As you know many, many people are currently unemployed and looking for work. Every now and then we get someone in the library (my day job) who asks to use the public Internet access computer. One man wanted to apply at Home Depot. Another WaWa (our version of 7-11), another as a security guard at one of the casinos. NONE of these businesses would allow anyone to apply by filling out a standard, old-fashioned, hard copy application. Applications on-line ONLY! You would be surprised at how many people have no experience AT ALL on a computer. And we are too short staffed to walk them through the long process of applying on-line. It's actually painful for me to watch a perfectly well-spoken 40-60 something person struggle and usually fail to apply for a job they're well suited for. It's just not right.

But I digress.

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Great point, Beth.

We actually have a blind ad in right now. Meaning, they don't know which office they're applying to only that it could be in their field. They have to email or paper mail their resume to an off site address. So, yeah, I get what you're saying.

But we have hired people who walked in, not knowing whether or not we were hiring and introduced themselves professionally. They stick in my mind and we do pull out their resume when it is hiring time.

Beth Ciotta said...

At least your office is offering an option, Elle. Email or snail mail. Computer or hard copy. The businesses I mentioned did not offer an option and I find that sad. There actually are people who never learned how to use a computer because they didn't need to, or want to, but are still extremely intelligent and qualified for one of many jobs that don't hinge on usuing a computer. That really bothers me.

SIS Beth

Grace Tyler said...

>>You would be surprised at how many people have no experience AT ALL on a computer.

This would not surprise me at all. I am married to one of those.

DH just started school in Dec. His second class was a basic computer class, just teaching them how to use basic programs. I set him up an email account, and I swear it took 10 times or more before he remembered how to log in and how to attach his assignments to submit them to his teacher. I despaired of him learning the stuff, but he really took it in and got an A!

Before this class, his best computer skill was looking at cars on eBay.

Beth Ciotta said...

That's a fantastic story, Grace. Yay for your hubby!

I remember when I first had to learn basic skills on the computer. I was so intimidated. I think that's the problem for a lot people. I was lucky enough to have a boss, actually two different bosses, who gave me one-on-one training in different programs. Great training ground for what I'm now doing at the library which is pretty involved computer wise.

Basic computer courses (or one-on-one teachers) are priceless.

SIS Beth

Mary Stella said...

I don't mind text-speak from a phone, although I recently teased my brother for using it in an email. I'll only cut him slack because he sent said email from his iPhone.

Funnier still is when he told me he had a CTJ talk with my nephew. After a mental "Huh?", I realized that meant "Come to Jesus". I laughed out loud. If you knew my brother's profession and his lack of religious leanings, you'd have laughed, too.

Overall, I think it sounds stupid as all get out when someone speaks in three or four letter acronyms. FWIW, it makes you sound TSTL and does not make me LMAO.

I don't accept text-speak as this generation's slang.

Every generation has its phrases, its terminology, its jargon. That's why there have been cool daddy-os, dreamboats, hunks and hotties. We've been hep, hip, solid and could totally dig it. Like, you know? If shorty wants to tell me what's popping, that's fine. The way some rappers spin out language is sick. (That's a good thing today.)

My true pet peeve is not with slang or text-speak, providing the speaker knows it's only a shortcut and not a replacement for proper, correct language. What angers me is that so many people don't have a solid grasp of proper grammar ans spelling. Somehow, the educational system and parents are falling short of making kids achieve these basic, essential skills.

This is not new. I distinctly remember when I was a college sophomore in 1976. I tutored other students in English. I should not have had to explain to a freshman that the third person form of a regular verb - to jump - is "She jumps", not "She jump".

Explain to me how someone graduates high school and gets accepted to a fairly decent college without knowing basic verb forms.

I edit/proof read a lot of material in my day job. A lot of different co-workers write this material and not all of them are experienced writers. Therefore, I can forgive the use of passive voice and the occasional preposition at the end of a sentence, or a misplaced modifier. These errors are easily fixed. Mistakes in grammar and spelling, on a level that we all learned in grade school, drive me crazy.

Am I perfect? Heck, no. Someone recently pointed out that I used "over" when I should have written "more than", and I frequently catch myself writing "may" instead of "might". That said, I know that "a lot" is two words and not to use "it's" when it should be "its". If you ask me where something is at, don't be surprised if I wince like you scraped your nails over a blackboard.

Great discussion, Elle.

Peace out. :-)

Elle J Rossi said...

Yay, Mary!

That's what I'm talkin' about, sista! I want to smooch you! Your words are what I've been getting at all day long. It's a sad, sad situation up in here and I'm not sure if it can be corrected. Simply, because enough people may/might not care. (You'll have to explain that one to me!)

Linda Wisdom said...

No kidding!

I don't know how many writing contest entries I've judged where a vampire was staked (porterhouse or sirloin?)or he/she peaked over the fence. Hmm.

When I talked at the college last week I talked about that. As in make sure you can spell!

I don't even shorten words when I text. Amazing anyone can read them.

Elle J Rossi said...

Hi Linda,

So glad you addressed this at that college. I wonder what went through their heads. Pfft...Of course I can spell!
(Yeah, right)

Seriously? Peaked over the fence? I LOVE IT!

Sisters-in-Sync said...

It's great to read the different POV's. But I must throw in just one more question.

Do you think that sometimes people mispronounce words (Optober for October, libary for library, supposebly for supposedly, medium for median, etc...) because that is what they heard throughout their childhood? I'm sure that's WHY they mispronounce them, but do they EVER hear them used/pronounced differently and think "OH! That's what it is!"?

I was 21 years old and working in a furniture store before I realized that a 5 drawer chest was a "chest of drawers" and not "chester drawers". It always sounded as if my grandmother was calling them chester drawers. Maybe she was...LOL

SIS Bren

Taylor said...

Wow, look at the controversy started here!! I'm just gonna throw in my two quick cents - I'm all for spelling correctly in the right places. I actually have friends who abbreviate words verbally. Like they say "Oh I def can do that!". It's the most annoying thing I've heard. I especially have to keep up on my spelling with what I'm studying, even so far as to making sure when to punctuate and capitalize correctly. We have to have a book called the AP (as in Associated Press) Stylebook which tells you how words, phrases, and important events should be written in any broadcasting sense. It's actually quite helpful, just not in business terms but in real life situations. So I'm with ya Barb, I'm all for spelling (although I just spelled you as ya..I know, I know!).

Amanda/Hermit said...

Wow, Barb/Elle, have you REALLY hit on a great topic! Whew! I almost swallowed a whole peanut M&M (ever wonder what the two M's stands for?) when I saw how many comments people have left!

First of all, what a relief to read that other people hate texting too. I absolutely refuse to text, not only because I don't have time to waste on poking a tiny phone's even tinier buttons, but because I feel that it's a dumbing-down social fad. That being said, I can admit that I do use a few acronyms in my emails. My favorite is LOL, which is sometimes varied with LMAO, or even LMFAO when I'm in a cussing mode. I occasionally use others, like JK (joke), WTF (as you mentioned), and *g* (grin).

About misspellings - I could write a list of the words that my friends and family (including my husband) commonly misspell. I tend to ignore their mistakes because, although I'm mostly a hermit, I still want friends at the end of the day. Some of the words that seem to cause people the most trouble are: too, two, to, their, they're and there. And it crawls under my skin when someone writes to me that 'there writers to'. Not that I'm perfect. I make my own share of spelling errors.

A crazy mistake I habitually made as a teenager was spelling the word 'hello' as 'hellow'. Could this have been because I grew up in Brown County's hills and 'hollows'? Not sure. But I finally corrected myself.

Oh, and I like Linda's 'peaked over the fence'. I might defend that... if it was in an erotic romance.

Elle J Rossi said...

Bren

You're right. Thank goodness I didn't continue to say, "I'm gonna warsh the dishes." That's obviously a regional thing. In my case, it only takes being embarrassed once for me to learn something a new way. The correct way. Love supposebly. That's a great one.

Elle J Rossi said...

Hi Taylor,

Yes. It all needs to be used at the proper time. When I text, I text spelling everything out. But that's just me. My hope is that for those who abbreviate while texting can remember that there is a proper spelling for those words,

Speaking these abbreviations out loud is bizarre. You should just stand there and blink at them next time.

Beth Ciotta said...

Mary, I'm so glad you hopped over and commented. I wish I could have presented my thoughts as eloquently as you. If you missed Mary's comment everyone, scroll back up and read.

What she said.

SIS Beth

Elle J Rossi said...

Hellow, Amanda, (That's a good one)

Please share your M & M's with everyone. It's the fair thing to do. The M's stand for the two men that created them. ( Forrest Mars Sr. and R. Bruce Murrie in 1939) I knew the Mars part but had to Google the other guy.

You don't text? Darn it! I was going to text you today.

Regarding to, two, too and their, there, they're. I heard somewhere that the english language is one of the hardest to learn because of words like these. I'm not sure if that's true but it makes sense to me. But when it's your first language, I just don't get it. It makes me think people just couldn't be bothered with learning it.

A lot of comments on this subject! It was fun to hear all the point of views.

Beth Ciotta said...

Am I post 100?! Am I? NOW do I get a prize?

Linda, your examples of misspelled words were priceless. I'm certainly not making fun, because I've made my own doozy mistakes in the past. But... heh.

SIS Beth

Beth Ciotta said...

Waving to Taylor and Amanda who made some great points! Thanks for sharing. Sorry for the breif note. Rushing for work.

And Brenda, yes, I think people sometimes mispronounce words because of what they heard as a child and yes, Barb, I believe it's often regional. I can't tell you how many times my husband's pointed out that I pronounced something incorrectly and I blink... what? Then I visit home and hear a family member or friend say it and I realize... it's regional.

SIS Beth

EmilyBryan said...

My DH says a smart man can think of two or three good ways to spell anything.

That said, I HATE to see things spelled incorrectly on signs, or worse having letters reversed (Toys R Us, for example which hits a double whammy with poor grammar as well as encouraging dyslexia!)

All the texting shorthand is just youth slang designed to differentiate the users from the uncool "others" who don't get it. That's so nothing new. Can't wait to see how their kids rebel!

TTYS,
Emily

Elle J Rossi said...

Emily,

The statement about your DH cracked me up this morning. Thanks for sharing.

Oh no! I'm uncool. When did that happen?

But I don't think it's just the kids. It's so many out there and growing every day.

Argh! That's my word for the day. Argh.

SIS BJ said...

Wow Barb, I woke up this morning and there are over 100 comments. Way to go!

May I say I am sorry to all teachers out there. I should have said school sytems instead of putting the blame on teachers. More parents need to step up to the plate and help out.

A. Y. Stratton said...

I admit I get a kick out of sounding out the abbreviations to figure out the meaning, but draw the line at misspelled words. And GRAMMAR mistakes. Not using the spell-check function tells the world you are sloppy.

Now, can we talk about misplaced apostrophes?

Linda Wisdom said...

Something that I happened to think of this morning.

When I was first married my dh was based in Boston and I worked for Sears there. My California accent was mistaken for Southern, British and Australian. Go figure.

My first day at work had a woman coming up to me saying "where's the pattins?" Huh? I had no clue what she meant. She considered me an idiot and finally said "dress pattins."

Elle J Rossi said...

Hello, A.Y.,

Welcome to SIS. I must admit, I struggle with apostrophes at times. I have to check with people or google the rules to make sure I have it right. I'd hate to send something to an editor or agent with simple grammatical mistakes.

I'll agree. It is fun to figure out what people are saying!

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